Hi Brittany being good and living a good life is hard! One of the most difficult aspects is forgiveness and when I studied Christianity this was one of the most difficult issues particularly since I grew up in Northern Ireland during our troubles and when our communities were scarred by Irish republican terrorism atrocities. Even in my later years I find it hard to forgive the terrorists who kidnapped tortured and destroyed innocent families yet after the peace process the same psychopaths took political office. I know Jesus would urge forgiveness but I have often wondered what Marcus Aurelius would say about it. I suspect he would demand justice and toss them to the lions!. I am pretty sure if what happened in Northern Ireland had happened in America none of the terrorists would still be alive today! Any views of how a stoic should approach this thorny issue? My approach with family members is to consider thar it is in the past, nothing can be changed and that no point reliving the trauma and move on. But being good is difficult!
Hi Tim, way to start the week out with hard questions!
I think when people say "forgiveness," they may have different meanings in mind, some of which are more valid than others. For example, some people equate saying, "I forgive you," with saying, "No worries, it's okay, no harm done." This can be harmful because it's important to acknowledge that harm was done and some people acted in an objectively bad (cruel, selfish, malicious, etc.) way. We don't want to pretend as though nothing vicious took place. If, however, by forgiveness we mean not clinging on to harm in your spirit, then forgiveness is ultimately necessary for healing and moving on. Like you say, there's no point in reliving trauma and staying trapped in the past.
As a Stoic I would say that we forgive people for ourselves, for our own wellbeing. Next week I'll share a quote by Seneca where he talks about gratitude benefitting the person who shows it more than the person who receives it. I think forgiveness, in the sense of letting go and moving on, is much the same. We are not good for the sake of someone else; we are good for ourselves, because we know that leads to the best life. Obviously society has to hold the perpetrators accountable and punish their deeds. This is required both on theoretical grounds (in the name of justice) but also on practical grounds (if no one faces punishment for crime, then some people will have an incentive to do more of it). Ultimately my take on Stoicism is similar to yours: we hold people accountable but don't hold on to sadness in our hearts.
Hi Brittany being good and living a good life is hard! One of the most difficult aspects is forgiveness and when I studied Christianity this was one of the most difficult issues particularly since I grew up in Northern Ireland during our troubles and when our communities were scarred by Irish republican terrorism atrocities. Even in my later years I find it hard to forgive the terrorists who kidnapped tortured and destroyed innocent families yet after the peace process the same psychopaths took political office. I know Jesus would urge forgiveness but I have often wondered what Marcus Aurelius would say about it. I suspect he would demand justice and toss them to the lions!. I am pretty sure if what happened in Northern Ireland had happened in America none of the terrorists would still be alive today! Any views of how a stoic should approach this thorny issue? My approach with family members is to consider thar it is in the past, nothing can be changed and that no point reliving the trauma and move on. But being good is difficult!
Hi Tim, way to start the week out with hard questions!
I think when people say "forgiveness," they may have different meanings in mind, some of which are more valid than others. For example, some people equate saying, "I forgive you," with saying, "No worries, it's okay, no harm done." This can be harmful because it's important to acknowledge that harm was done and some people acted in an objectively bad (cruel, selfish, malicious, etc.) way. We don't want to pretend as though nothing vicious took place. If, however, by forgiveness we mean not clinging on to harm in your spirit, then forgiveness is ultimately necessary for healing and moving on. Like you say, there's no point in reliving trauma and staying trapped in the past.
As a Stoic I would say that we forgive people for ourselves, for our own wellbeing. Next week I'll share a quote by Seneca where he talks about gratitude benefitting the person who shows it more than the person who receives it. I think forgiveness, in the sense of letting go and moving on, is much the same. We are not good for the sake of someone else; we are good for ourselves, because we know that leads to the best life. Obviously society has to hold the perpetrators accountable and punish their deeds. This is required both on theoretical grounds (in the name of justice) but also on practical grounds (if no one faces punishment for crime, then some people will have an incentive to do more of it). Ultimately my take on Stoicism is similar to yours: we hold people accountable but don't hold on to sadness in our hearts.
agreeed!