My interview with the Greek newspaper Kathimerini
Stoic psychological techniques, emotions, and living well in the 21st century
Today I’m delighted to share an interview I did with Deppie Kourellou, journalist with the Greek national newspaper Kathimerini, about how Stoicism can help us in the 21st century. We talked about Stoic psychological techniques, emotions, ethics, preferred indifferents, and much more. You can read the published article in Kathimerini: Live Your Life According to the Ancient Stoics.
I’m also sharing my original responses here, since of course some was trimmed out or changed a bit during the translation and editing process. There is a bit more context here that you might find helpful. It’s always difficult to package a broad philosophy of life into small bites that can be easily understood, but I think this gives a good overview of Stoicism. I hope you find it useful!
How Stoicism can help us today:
The really interesting thing about Stoicism is that while society and technology have changed drastically in the past 2,000 years, human nature hasn’t changed at all! Biologically we are still the same as we were when Socrates and Marcus Aurelius were alive. The ancient Stoics based their philosophy on their observations of human nature and developed a psychology that is surprisingly similar to modern cognitive psychology. Therefore most of their ideas about human psychology—and their prescriptions for healing our psyche—are just as true today as they were then.
Of course, the challenge for modern Stoics is to apply this ancient way of life to the 21st century. The Roman philosopher Seneca said, “Those who advanced these doctrines before us are not our masters but our guides. The truth lies open to all; it has not yet been taken over. Much is left also for those yet to come.” It’s up to each generation to discover how to apply these timeless truths to the specific challenges of their time. That’s what we are currently doing in modern Stoicism.
Stoicism and psychotherapy:
The most popular type of psychotherapy used today is cognitive behavioral therapy (CBT), which was developed in the mid-20th century by Aaron Beck. Beck said that his work was inspired by the Stoics, and CBT relies on Epictetus’ idea that many psychological problems are caused by distorted thinking. As Epictetus says, “It isn't the things themselves that disturb people, but the judgments that they form about them.” CBT uses Stoic-inspired techniques to help change our judgments and teach us a more realistic and accepting approach to life.
However, there are some differences. CBT is a short-term intervention to deal with pathologies (in other words, things that are wrong). Stoicism is a lifelong way of living that involves the whole person, including values, opinions, emotions, behavior, interactions with other people, everyday decisions, and life choices. It’s much more focused on living a good life. So CBT offers a small snapshot of Stoic-flavored ideas, but Stoicism as a philosophy is much broader and all-encompassing.
Overcoming negative thoughts:
Epictetus suggests that it’s not things themselves that bother us; it’s our opinions about things that bother us. He uses the example of Socrates: while most people fear death, Socrates did not fear death. Therefore it is not death itself that provokes a fearful reaction, but rather the reaction is caused by our opinion that death is a bad thing. If you change your opinion, you also change your emotional reaction. So if you stop believing that death is a bad thing, you lose your fear of it.
This is just one example, but it applies to pretty much everything in life. Once you understand that pain itself is not bad—it’s just a natural part of life that everyone experiences—you lose your negative emotions toward pain. Once you understand that money is not the basis for happiness, you lose your fear of poverty. It’s all about changing your values. The emotions flow naturally from your values and what you think is important in life.
Caring too much about other people’s opinions:
This problem existed in ancient times too, but it’s so much worse now because of social media. Humans are social creatures and we always live in groups, which means we naturally care about other people. This goes in two directions: we love others and we also want to be loved by others. These are good and normal emotions, and they help us to feel connected to family, friends, and community.
Problems arise when society and technology change to focus on superficial connections rather than deep connections. We all naturally want love, belonging, a secure place in the world, and being deeply appreciated by others. Today we have the opposite. Social media and today’s culture encourage very shallow and unstable connections. People are judged on superficial factors such as appearance, money, external achievements, or number of followers. We end up chasing other people’s approval because we don’t have a deep and secure source of love in our own lives.
Stoicism helps us develop a deep source of love in our own lives, so we don’t need to chase after other people’s approval. We turn to the timeless wisdom of nature, which guides us to be simple, good, and happy. We learn to love and trust ourselves so we don’t rely on other people’s judgments of us. We learn to tune out all the negativity our culture throws at us and stop comparing ourselves to others. We start turning to trusted guides, such as ancient philosophers or modern role models, to think about the best way to live.
Basis of love and morality in Stoicism:
In Stoicism love and morality are based on wisdom and truth. According to the ancient Stoics, when we understand the true nature of the world and our own human nature, we will automatically want to be kind, loving people. Stoics think humans are naturally sociable and affectionate. Sometimes people get messed up by false impressions and false messages from society, and they start to think that happiness lies in gaining money, power, and material possessions. That’s when the problems start. So Stoicism advocates going back to our natural way of being in the world. We can strip away all the false impressions and false messages from society, relearning how to be naturally wise and loving. The Stoics think we all have the seeds of virtue within us, and we just have to cultivate our inner goodness.
Are Stoics apathetic about the world?
We avoid using the word “apathy” because it sounds like you don’t care about anything! There is a misperception that Stoicism advocates not caring about people or things, but this is incorrect. Stoics just choose carefully what’s worth caring about. We let go of the unimportant things that don’t lead to true happiness and instead focus on the true and important things. In other words, we learn to care wisely. We understand that we can’t control what other people do, but we can still love people and work for a better world.
Going back to the original Greek word, apatheia, we can see it just means not having patheiai. The ancient Stoics understood patheiai to be strong, uncontrollable emotions like anger, fear, greed, guilt, sadness, etc. These emotions tend to take over our minds and lead us to act in ways we later regret. That’s why we want to eliminate them. Stoicism is about eliminating the bad emotions that lead us to make bad decisions, while cultivating the good emotions (such as cheerfulness and goodwill) that lead us to make good decisions.
Therefore when we look at social or political movements, a Stoic will participate in a wise way: remembering what’s important, remembering what we can and cannot control, and cultivating healthy thoughts and behaviors such as friendship and self-control.
How to live well:
The main thing is to understand what’s truly important in life: your character and being a good person. At my nonprofit organization Stoicare, which focuses on Stoic wellbeing, we recommend that people concentrate on four main components of living well. I think this is a great place to start:
Find healthy ways to manage stress and emotions
Develop resilience in the face of challenges and difficulties
Find purpose and fulfillment in your life
Learn to thrive in personal and professional roles
Practicing Stoicism in daily life:
Learn about Stoic ideas through reading or watching videos – For videos I recommend two YouTube channels, Modern Stoicism and Gregory B. Sadler.
Reflect and meditate on Stoic ideas – Try to spend 5 minutes in the morning thinking about how you will incorporate Stoic ideas into your day, and in the evening spend 5 minutes reflecting on how you did that day.
Journal about how to incorporate Stoic ideas into your life – You can try my book Journal Like a Stoic, but there are also other good journals available.
Talk with friends and mentors about Stoic wellbeing – Find a group of likeminded people who are on the same journey. I recommend visiting www.stoicfellowship.com to find Stoic groups near you.
Embody Stoic principles for wellbeing – Keep yourself physically and mentally healthy through healthy lifestyle habits (exercise, healthy eating, getting enough sleep), meditation and breathing techniques, spending time in nature, and developing your social connections.
Thanks for the mention of The Stoic Fellowship at the end. In the new year, TSF is helping new Stoic groups pop-up around the world!